Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by christy on December 12, 2011 at 5:42pm

I think there is some truth to that. I just read a interesting article last night about Joslin medal winners. How they are wondering what the common factor is that so many of these people reaching the 50 year mark are relatively complication free.

http://health.msn.com/health-topics/diabetes/long-term-survivors-ar...

I think there is definately a LOT we still don't know, and I am positive there are varying degrees of Type 1 as well.

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Permalink Reply by Jen on December 12, 2011 at 6:43pm

Interesting! Have they ruled out that the 50-year medalists just had tighter control than everyone else for some reason? I don't think I know anyone who has had diabetes for 50 years in person. I know a few who have had it for 45 years, but all of them have complications.

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Permalink Reply by Sweet Lady on December 12, 2011 at 6:59pm

This is great. Thanks for sharing!

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Permalink Reply by christy on December 12, 2011 at 7:14pm

Yes I found it very interesting to. Unfortunately this article doesn't really go into a lot of detail at how well these people have been under control or much information like that. I imagine they have had good control...but when you think over the course of 50 years, control could have only been SO good 50 years ago. I find it strange too, how some people can seem to not be in as good of control and remain relatively free of complications, while others seem more prone to complications regardless of how well they control. I certainly think good control is key, but it kind of makes you wonder if there isn't also I dont know other factors as well, our genetic make-up, etc that doesn't also have a hand in the control we keep and the complications we may or may not develop.

My personal thought is, I think it has something to do with the longer you can remain complication free, the less chance you have of developing certain problems.

A lot of health problems have peak ages where incident is higher to develop, but that chance decreases after a certain age. Might have something to do with this too.

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Permalink Reply by acidrock23 on December 12, 2011 at 5:49pm

There are different kinds of people so there's likely to be different kinds of T1, T2, Alzheimer's, ALS and any other ghastly disorder one might come up with.

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Permalink Reply by Sean401 on December 12, 2011 at 6:46pm

I am diagnosed as a secondary Type 1. To me it is the same as a T1, I take insulin 4 times a day and Pills 2 times a day. They call it secondary because my main problem is my pancreas (Due to having severe Pancreatitus). My Endo says my Pancreas will never operate normal again but I pray that it will some day.

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Permalink Reply by kiva on December 12, 2011 at 7:06pm

I've always viewed Diabetes as a spectrum disorder for lack of better words. There are primarily two issues (spectrums) at hand that each and every Diabetic has to deal with to one extreme or the other. Regardless of Type, the two issues at hand are insulin production (one either produces enough or not) and sensitivity/resistance, which are just opposite ends of the second spectrum.

Type 1's clearly have production issues although I suspect the degree of deficiency can vary from one individual to the next making management easier for some and harder for others. Type 1's also deal with sensitivity/resistance issues as well . . ie, varying I:C ratios with some even going on to develop the severity of insulin resistance issues of a Type 2.

Type 2's production issues may be a little murkier. Clearly there are production issues as the pancreas is limited in how much insulin it can produce . . . seriously . . . if only the pancreas would make enough, isn't this a production issue? However, this is why diet, exercise and drugs associated with T2 can be so effective. Lower the resistance and the pancreas is now capable of sustaining homeostasis, or increase production if needed to overcome resistance . . . or do both.

However, even among those T2's there are those in which the drugs just don't cut it so exogenous insulin is required. Some take serious amounts of insulin and some like me don't. I get by on a TDD of 45-50u.

At one point my doctor asked me what type I thought I was. I told him I clearly wasn't your stereo typical T1 and not exactly a typical T2 either. He suggested that some people are hard to type and not to spend to much effor to figure it out, what's really important is getting a handle on management.

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Permalink Reply by Natalie ._c- on December 12, 2011 at 8:44pm

Well, the definition of Type 1 is auto-immune destruction of the beta cells, so in that sense, there is only one kind of Type 1. But there are a lot of other variables that come into play that make each person with Type 1 different from the others. As someone else said, insulin resistance occurs on a spectrum; it's not an either/or proposition. If you are more insulin resistant, you can make larger errors of insulin dosage, and not see such wide swings of BGs. And insulin production varies, too -- some Type 1's make detectable amounts of insulin -- maybe enough to make control easier, while others make none at all. Thirdly, each person's gut, adipose tissue and brain hormones are different, and some people apportion more of their glucose to the energy bucket, and some more to the fat bucket, and that will make a difference in blood sugars, too, because the energy people will have better glucose transporters in their cells, and burn glucose much more efficiently. And then there must be genetic or environmental factors that determine why some people get complications and others don't. It's NOT just glucose, but how the cells in the body respond to high glucose. If they don't glycate easily, maybe those people won't get complications.

So the ultimate answer is, yes, people with Type 1 DO vary a lot, and no one treatment or diet or routine fits all.

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Permalink Reply by MyBustedPancreas on December 13, 2011 at 6:07am

No, that's not true. There is type 1A and type 1B diabetes. People with Type 1B diabetes have impaired insulin production but do not have the antibodies seen in type 1A diabetics. (see http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejm200002033420501).

Strictly speaking, "type 1" diabetes refers to lack of insulin production (thus making a person dependent on exogenous insulin). But the causes for that lack of insulin production can vary. Someone who has his/her pancreas removed because of a tumor, for example, will be classified as a type 1 diabetic because they do not make insulin. However, they will not have antibodies.

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Permalink Reply by Natalie ._c- on December 13, 2011 at 10:35am

Type 1b is just the way that some researchers characterize the diabetes that occurs primarily in blacks, but sometimes in Asians and Native Americans, in which they present in DKA, but are able to go off insulin when they get back in control. Halle Berry has that type of diabetes. Other terms for it are Ketosis-Prone Type 2, and Flatbush Diabetes. MIchael Barker has very good information on it on his webpage. Because of the lack of consistency in describing it, I didn't include it in my definition of Type 1. It's really a totally different disease from classic Type 1.

In addition, lack of insulin production is NOT the characteristic feature of Type 1's, or else all Type 2's who lose insulin function would turn into Type 1's. People with surgically induced diabetes are considered "other".

But I agree, diabetes terminology is confusing and incomplete. I don't think they have described all the types of diabetes that are out there, and wouldn't be surprised if they change terminology yet again some time in the future.

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Permalink Reply by Brian (bsc) on December 13, 2011 at 5:13am

It is certainly true that blood sugar control is not just all about insulin. In non-diabetics, glucagon plays an important role counterbalancing insulin in maintaining good blood sugar control. But beyond these there are clearly other factors which affect blood sugar control, and they are not little things. These are things which can just mess you up big time. For instance, sodium is known to play a critical role in glucose uptake and hence sodium deficiency can impair the efficiency of insulin. I guess it would be safe to say that this is probably true for most of the electrolytes, I have seen mention of potassium, magnesium and zinc all implicated in the overall metabolic processes. So basically, if you are having trouble with your electrolytes, then that can further mess things up. And these problems may or may not be related to your T1.

And other autoimmune conditions occur together with T1. In fact there is a name for it, PolyGlandular Autoimmune Syndrome. PGA links T1 with other autoimmune conditions (in a cluster of conditions) like Addisons disease, thyroid conditions, myasthenia gravis, celiac, pernacious anemia and other disorders. Many of these can make blood sugar control difficult. PGA is thought to be genetically linked to specific HLA haplotypes. PGA often occurs when you are in your 30s and 40s.

And as to your question about MODY. It is entirely possible to have both T1 and MODY. Most would consider them independent problems. But most forms of MODY are characterized by good insulin sensitivity and you would expect that you would actually respond well to insulin. In the case of MODY-3, you have a reduced natural insulin response at high blood sugar levels, but their blood sugar responds well to external insulin (amost too well). You still struggle. You probably don't have MODY.

I don't mean to scare you. But there are lots of things that could be happening. And your latest problems may simply be some other form of health problem which has thrown your body out of whack. It may well turn out to be totally unrelated to your diabetes.

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Permalink Reply by Jen on December 13, 2011 at 6:45am

Wow, had no idea you could have MODY plus Type 1. I did know you can have Type 1 plus Type 2, though. I've also heard of people who thought they had Type 1 for years and then find out as an adult they really have MODY.

I think with the problems I've been having lately I just want some cause, no matter how horrible (I mean, better to know and deal with it than not). My blood sugars were actually decent yesterday and hopefully today as well. Amazing how much better that alone makes me feel!

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