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Permalink Reply by jims on September 20, 2011 at 11:31pm

Tried that - didnt help.

metformin 500 mg at 10:00 pm and 12:00am midnight was only thing that stopped nonsense and massive overloading
of glucose and taking 500 mg met 1 hour before meals stops any spurious liver dumps as gut emptying down and bg is well within correct numbers 140 thru 200. no met on duty in blood; dump will be 278 to 315. in fact watching with finger stick
rapidly (cgms cannot track fastest part of peak) as bg jumps up to 511 hi and then slides back to 278 to 315.

this crap is not funny. Met on duty - up to strength shows disturbance when liver tries to dump but gets stopped in full dump by met.

basil amounts insulin - lantus - does help body run better but Does not stop dawn effect and or excessive full liver dumps.

so far only met seems to stop.

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Permalink Reply by Brian (bsc) on September 21, 2011 at 3:39am

Actually, insulin does suppress the Darn Phenomenon. The action is pretty well undershtood. Some people believe that part of the cause of DP is that your body naturally clears insulin more actively in the early morning hours 3-5am. So for most, simply increasing the overnight basal insulin, particularly in that window can markedly reduce DP.

I tried metformin as a way of suppressing DP, all the way up to 2.5g at night, but it never worked. I think I am just insulin deficient. For literally years, I never saw a morning blood sugar under 100 mg/dl, usually much higher. Once I got my insulin properly adjusted, under normal circumstances, I almost never see a reading over 100 mg/dl in the morning.

But in the end, everyone is different. If metformin works for you, then that is a win.

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Permalink Reply by Jeannie Wagner on September 21, 2011 at 8:03am

The 2 things that have worked for me are the maximum dose of metformin 2550 mg and a very low carb/high fat diet. If I eat more than 40 carbs a day the DP comes back with a vengence. I also take my last metformin right before my head hits the pillow and take the next one as early as possible in the morning. I take the third pill around 10:00 am to preven liver spikes in the late morning.

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Permalink Reply by jims on September 21, 2011 at 9:22am

nope. timing is key. single large doses never worked for me. taking 500 mg dose at 10:00pm
and dose at 12:00am always works and is working today. i am tired of arguing with pill jockeys over this.

The key is continuous dosage up to strength in blood over the key interval. One large dose still only covers the same duration as small single charge in blood and useless.

I do not know what dum turkey in pill industry thinks that because you put huge up front charge the body automatically redistributes the larger charge ove rmore time.

How stupid! WHere is that written in the liver-gut specs. Residual metforman has no use shutting down liver glucose overcharge as only up to strength in blood works. The mwtformin effigy charge lasts 1 to 3 hours on standard met. Irregardless of pill dose.

ER versions so far do not work and Teva of both types useless while most generic decent types work.

Been there done that.

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Permalink Reply by jasonb on February 22, 2012 at 5:11am

Just curious, what is you basal number to combat DP tan that of your 12am basal?

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Permalink Reply by jims on April 30, 2012 at 12:15pm

What people do not realize when adding insulin, basil or otherwise is that if liver hammers body so hard, the insulin resistance gets turned on hard and that a large charge of insulin will just sit and circulate in body till muscle cells get off loaded of glucose by exercise.

Once I walked the dam glucose readings at 238 in my body down after walking 2 miles down to 140, I would see the injected insulin take off and do its job. i.e. the body can dynamically upgrade and downgrade the insulin receptors of the skeletal muscles based on level of glucose content in skeletal muscles glucose stores.

Science continues to believe in a infinite glucose storage model that does not exist - nor work.

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