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Permalink Reply by MTendler on October 19, 2009 at 3:43pm

In an ironic twist of fate, I'll lead off the discussion:

I'm the co-founder of MYLEstone Health, and we make Glucose Buddy.
Logging diabetes numbers is not the holy grail, in fact, far from it.

As a Type 1 diabetic, I do log, and it helps me recognize trends every day. It's not the fact that I can review past logs, but it's more that I'm taking the time to think about my numbers and see my reactions to food and medication variables.

Is it overwhelming? Absolutely.
Could it be frivolous if not done consistently? Absolutely.

I compare it to going to the gym;
If you go for 5 minutes once a week, you're not going to see any results.

If you go 1 hour a day, 5 days a week, you'll see substantial results...
however, if you have a trainer you could see the same results in half the time.

Unfortunately, finding a worthy diabetes educator/doctor is more difficult than going to your local gym and asking them to assign you a personal trainer.

Glucose Buddy, as it stands now, would never claim that it was the Holy Grail. What we're doing at MYLEstone is expanding Glucose Buddy's capabilities to include other things such as Education, Entertainment, Logging, Social Networking, etc. with the hope that somewhere within Glucose Buddy a diabetic will be able to better their life.

However, I'd also like to share that I've received hundreds of Emails and have had hundreds of conversations with diabetics that have told me that Glucose Buddy, as itself, is THEIR holy grail. This further displays the notion that what works for some simply doesn't work for others.

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Permalink Reply by Don Kelly on October 19, 2009 at 3:49pm

When I was using the Ultra Smart I logged my exercise, my bg, my carb intake... This was so my endo and CDE could find patterns and gave me somewhat better control, now that I'm Ping'd my pump records everything except my exercise... Which according to my CDE is not a big thing as long as I know what days I excercise. I donload my pump to ezManager and set it up on a file drop for my CDE and endo so they can look at it at their leisure. Seems to work. Now the reporting for ezManager... Lacks a bunch but that can be a whole subject by itself !

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Permalink Reply by Scott on October 19, 2009 at 4:16pm

I rarely tested at all, let alone logged, until I started pumping. If it wasn't for the pump keeping track of things for me, I might still not be. The amount of information req'd to really be successful is daunting, esp when you look at the logging of that information for literally decades. Right now it seems that a pump/meter combo seems to offer the best tools

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Permalink Reply by Terry Keelan on October 19, 2009 at 4:30pm

I was terrible at keeping a written log. I rely on my meter and my pump to keep track of my BG, my carb intake and my insulin intake. My doctor and my CDE do a pretty thorough job of reviewing the numbers with me, but I wouldn't think of faxing them in or emailing them to get an opinion - I know they don't have time for that. Besides, they'd be looking at the numbers in a vacuum.

I do wonder often why I keep these numbers, since I look at them rarely and when I do it's a major chore to figure out what they all mean. I see the overall trends (e.g., bg tending to rise before lunch, frequent lows before dinner, frequent bed time highs) and adjust accordingly - i.e. by the seat of my pants. I'm going to examine the KEAS project Amy mentioned. I'd like to see some real time explanation of wtf these numbers add up to.

Terry

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Permalink Reply by Jasmine Ong on October 19, 2009 at 4:53pm

I passionately HATE logging, and if I found a tool that made it easy (i.e., nearly effortless) I might be more willing to do it, but I quit regular logging about 9 years ago, since after 12 (at that time) years of Type 1 diabetes, I didn't really see any advantages to doing it. I had been told by doctors, CDEs, etc to log to find patterns, but I keep such an irregular schedule that it doesn't really help, and even when I tried living a very scheduled life, my health care team didn't seem to have much helpful input about patterns from the information I provided.

But again, that was 9 years ago. A lot has changed since then in terms of the tools available to us to make this work, but I still hate writing down every blood sugar, insulin dose, exercise session, bite of food consumed with carb counts, and every other tiny factor that can affect my blood sugar. I'd love to hear about anyone else's success with a logging tool, or any recommendations they have. I wore a pump for more than 12 years and took it off last year, so while I used to have a record of doses and glucose readings from the devices that issued/took them, now I only have the BG readings. Any logging I ever do happens the good old fashioned way-- writing it down in a notebook. I don't use the pre-printed logbooks because I've also never found one of those that suits my needs (I know, I'm way too fussy). But that logging tends to last about three days at the longest.

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Permalink Reply by Donna Heun on October 19, 2009 at 8:19pm

I hated logging on paper but I did it and never used it. Now I have diabetes pilot on my palm pilot and it helps me track BGs, exercise, it has a food database so I can keep track of how many calories, carbs, fiber, protien etc. I am getting. I use the information and make changes accordingly. I also have an insulin pump and CGMS that can also be downloaded and the info used so that i can make changes to achieve better glycemic control. It is not a waste of my time because It to help me. If the info isn't used or someone doesn't understand how to put it to use, then it is a waste of time and energy and isn't helpful at all.

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Permalink Reply by Dori S on October 19, 2009 at 9:16pm

I'm a T2 and love the wavesense app for the iphone. I did write down my results prior to using the app but this is so much easier. I log to see how I am doing and am able to compare it with my nutrition for that day/meal. I use the bodybugg program for that. This allows me to adjust my diet and carb intake so that I can better control my BG. For instance I have found that carbs (more than 10-15g) are bad for me for breakfast and if I do have some carbs I need to balance it with a certain amount of protein. Since my log is on my phone I am also sure to have it with me when I see my Dr. I would absolutely love it if the new upcoming bluetooth wavesense meter would sync with the computer as well as the iphone.

I think this is one of those areas that is a personal decision and you get out of it what you put into it. Before I started using it to help figure out what I can and can not eat it was just a bunch of numbers I wrote down because my Dr wanted to see them at my appts.

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Permalink Reply by Christina on October 20, 2009 at 4:31am

I find it to be a pain in the butt. lol, but I try to do it most of the time.
I keep them in a "diabetes diary" from www.coheso.com
They are pretty cool.
I think I have a problem with logging as much as knowing how much of the food I ate and calculating the carbs. By the time I've done all that, I feel too lazy to write all the info down lol.

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Permalink Reply by Kat on October 20, 2009 at 5:44am

I lwrite down my numbers, the carbs I ate and the amount of insulin I used on good old fashioned paper, because for me it is the fastest way. I use whatever logbook my endo has available at the time, as long as it has enough space. During the week I keep a very regular schedule, so this is easy for me. The logbook is extremely helpful for me, because I adjust my dosages a lot short term. A few days of stress and bad eating for example will make me more insulin resistant for a few days, before everything goes back to normal. Without the log book I'd have a lot more roller coaster days.

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Permalink Reply by Brian (bsc) on October 20, 2009 at 5:57am

I have a bit a different take on the whole issue of "logging." I "log" my BS and write down notable variations in my meals, medication and other factors. I keep a small book for this matter and use it to annotate my downloaded meter readings. I analyse the readings in an excel spreadsheet to understand my standard deviation, analyze the effect of medication changes and perform my own little "human experiments." I find that I can often point to personal achievements that I would not be able to see if I did not log.

For exercise this has turned out to be critical for me. I also maintain detailed logs for exercising. I write down every weight lifted and how many times. Pages and pages of this stuff. I have spreadsheets of stuff over months and years with my progress (or non progress). But let me tell you, if you do an activity like exercise and you cannot see improvement, it becomes frustrating. In many cases, you won't be able to "see" your improvement unless you make these observations and write them down. To me, if I go in the gym and lift a weight one more time than I did before, then that get's marked as a Personal Record (PR). These little accomplishments make a big difference in my attitude and how I look forward to going to the gym.

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Permalink Reply by Leo2 on October 20, 2009 at 6:44am

Yes, I log.
I use a 4x6" 50 page notebook in my purse, a one page per month columned dealie on Word printed out so I can write on it, and an Excel spreadsheet (added to about every week)..
Never overwhelming. Love numbers. Tweak numbers.
I believe in analyzing, seeing causes, interpreting, rooting out problems and enjoying.
Each type of logging is for a different reason: in the notebook I save time by having the grams available from favorite foods on previous pages. It's a page a day so serves for 100 days. I write down the time, preeating results, exact food being eaten, total gms, and units - and that's when I give insulin. I write down shopping, exercise, and number grams taken. Correction doses are in there.
The columned page is for viewing patterns for times of day and scanning down days at suppertime, for example,. It lets me see tests that are creeping up. It puts together the number grams and units in close approximation at the six times of day I might put food in my mouth.
The Excel is for seeing at intervals how the averages and standard deviation are moving through the month. It also figures daily sensitivity and ratios for feedback.
I like my system: with the 3 parts, it has made me take time to look at the data from different vantage points. I was called "brittle". I think tweaking over time removes brittleness as one resets targets. I've tried apps; I used the Dexcom's system & profited from it (compared its data with the foods in my notebook). We need to try different methods, experiment with them. I think using more than one method makes you have to take time for comparisons, for analysis. And time for analysis is a key. ( My A1c is in the 5s consistently; standard deviation between 5 and 12 consistently; no lows; average 96).

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Permalink Reply by Billy Williamson on October 20, 2009 at 7:20am

I'm terrible for logging... when i was first diagnosed i logged everything... i had whole notebooks filled with dates and a ton of numbers. However... when something went wrong with my A1C and my endo accused me of lying about my numbers and wouldn't consider any other cause for the high A1C i quit logging because it didn't seem to be worth the time and effort it took to do all that work if my endo was just going to disregard it. Now i have a new endo because i'm an adult but I still don't log. I know i should start especially with the new technology and all but... haha anyway that's my story

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